Sacrament and Dogma Archives

PSM5 – The Marian Mystery and the Liturgy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 34:55 — 24.1MB) | Embed

Episode 5 – The Marian Mystery and the Liturgy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg Ph.D.

Dr. David Fagerberg and Kris McGregor discuss the mystical participation of the Blessed Virgin Mary in the liturgy.

Here are some of the topics explored in this episode:

What is the relationship between Mary and the liturgy of the Church?

What is Liturgical Dogma?

Why is dogma important?

What is the authentic nature of “full and active participation”?

From the discussion with Dr. Fagerberg:

There’s a relationship between Mary and the liturgy. She’s the model of the spiritual attitude with which the church celebrates and lives. The divine mysteries, any names for Mary is the attentive Virgin. She’s the Virgin in prayer. She’s the Virgin Mother and the Virgin presenting offerings. What do we do in liturgy? This is what Paul VI goes through. In this document, we seek to be attentive, to offer a prayer, to be the maternal church that gathers the world under the wings and heals its sufferings and presents offerings. Mary is a model of a spiritual attitude, which every Christian should have when he or she celebrates and lives the divine mysteries. So she’s not a replacement of the mystery. She’s the model for how we live and express those mysteries.

More taken from the discussion:

The words which are vehicles for Spirit are revelatory in Scripture, but they’re dogmatic in other forms. And dogmas are words, and you have to use the right words. The doctor is writing the prescription for you. He can’t prescribe arsenic instead of aspirin, it matters which words he writes down on the pad. It matters what terms we use in our dogma. And that’s why the Church argues over these things. You have to have the wording just right. As Chesterton has said, the Church is a lion tamer, and she’s running with tigers and lions and dragons. And everything has to be just right in order to keep the balance. One wrong slip of words, Chesterton finishes, and all the stained glass would be broken and all the Christmas trees destroyed. Yeah. As it happened, when we goofed up our understanding of the sacramentality of the church, broke windows, and whitewashed the art, you have to be very careful in how you prescribe it.

We prefer to have a kind of loosey-goosey why can’t we just say, be healthy? Why do we have to have doctors and med school and big medical manuals? Well, because it matters how strong a dose you prescribe. You have to argue about this. And sometimes the arguments have to go on for 300 years before we pinned down our correct definition of transubstantiation in order to make sense out of reality and symbol…John Carbone, again in his book, Wellspring of Worship writes The Virgin Mary is the Church as it dawns in a single person. Let’s see who knew that? Oh yeah. Second Vatican Council Lumen Gentium, the document on the Church. How should we end this with a chapter on Mary? Mary is the Church as it dawns in a single person.

For more podcast episodes of this series, visit the
Pathways to Sacred Mysteries w/Dr. David Fagerberg page

David W. Fagerberg is a Professor in the Department of Theology at the University of Notre Dame. He holds master’s degrees from Luther Northwestern Seminary, St. John’s University (Collegeville), Yale Divinity School, and Yale University. His Ph.D. is from Yale University in liturgical theology.

Fagerberg’s work has explored how the Church’s lex credendi (law of belief) is founded upon the Church’s lex orandi (law of prayer). This was expressed in Theologia Prima (Hillenbrand Books, 2003). He has integrated into this the Eastern Orthodox understanding of asceticism by considering its role in preparing the liturgical person. This was treated in On Liturgical Asceticism (Catholic University Press, 2013). And these two themes come together in Consecrating the World: On Mundane Liturgical Theology (Angelico Press, 2016).

He also has an avocation in G. K. Chesterton, having published Chesterton is Everywhere (Emmaus Press, 2013) and The Size of Chesterton’s Catholicism (University of Notre Dame, 1998).

Here are a few of Dr. Fagerberg’s books:

PSM6 – The Synergy of Liturgy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 24:10 — 16.7MB) | Embed

Episode 6 – The Synergy of Liturgy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg Ph.D.

Dr. David Fagerberg and Kris McGregor discuss what is meant by full and active participation in the liturgy.

Here are some of the topics explored in this episode:

The difference between being involved with ministry and being consciously present to the mystery of God.

The nature of synergy in regards to liturgy, and in particular the celebration of the mass.

From the discussion with Dr. Fagerberg:

God plans to be fully, actively, and consciously present in liturgy. That’s His presence from above. What should I do in response? Maybe I should be full, active, conscious response to his presence. That would be a nice filling out of the idea of participation because participation doesn’t mean activity that I generate. Participation is my response to his presence. He’s full, active, consciously present. I’m full, actively, consciously responding.

The Greek word for that is synergy, S Y N E R G Y. And syn means “together”, enérgeia means an energy or an activity at work. Here are two examples. One of them is synergy. One of them is not synergy. Mom is coming. The apartment is a mess. You clean up that room. I’ll clean up this room. Together, they cleaned up the apartment. The second, example is in order to have fire, you must have matter, spark, and oxygen. They have to operate together. The first example is just two people doing an activity at the same time. In the second example, the one makes possible the other makes it occur. Well, synergy is that second example. It’s co operatio (co-operate), synergy. God’s graces and we faith. God energizes and we synergize. He takes the lead in the ballroom dancing and we follow. We co-operate. Well, that leads me to suppose that it’s not a matter of laity co-operating with the clergy. Rather laity and clergy should co-operate the liturgy which is occurring at this moment. And in our liturgy, the human liturgy, the liturgy of the Church, it is a cooperation with the full, active and conscious presence of God. He makes himself present. We make this response.

For more podcast episodes of this series, visit the
Pathways to Sacred Mysteries w/Dr. David Fagerberg page

He also has an avocation in G. K. Chesterton, having published Chesterton is Everywhere (Emmaus Press, 2013) and The Size of Chesterton’s Catholicism (University of Notre Dame, 1998).

Here are a few of Dr. Fagerberg’s books:

PSM7 – The Definition of Liturgy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 31:35 — 21.8MB) | Embed

Episode 7 – The Definition of Liturgy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg Ph.D.

Dr. David Fagerberg and Kris McGregor discuss a “thicker” definition of liturgy.

Here are some of the topics explored in this episode:

Liturgy is the perichoresis of the Trinity kenotically extended to invite our synergistic ascent into deification.

From the discussion with Dr. Fagerberg:

So conversion metanoia means to take on a new mind, to receive a new mind. Well, what could you do with a new mind? I might see things differently. I might change my values. They might be turned upside down from selfish values to kingdom values. Conversion is one step, but it’s a lifelong step. The entire life is a extended baptismal conversion. So one baptism doesn’t end something. It starts something the same way that a wedding starts a marriage. It’s it’s not the end of the marriage. It’s the beginning of the marriage. And baptism is the start of what, what do you want to call? The thing that baptism is the start of, Christianity, spirituality, your liturgical life, your spiritual warfare, your joys in the kingdom. It’s the beginning.

For more podcast episodes of this series, visit the Pathways to Sacred Mysteries w/Dr. David Fagerberg page

He also has an avocation in G. K. Chesterton, having published Chesterton is Everywhere (Emmaus Press, 2013) and The Size of Chesterton’s Catholicism (University of Notre Dame, 1998).

Here are a few of Dr. Fagerberg’s books:

PSM8 – The Life of Mystagogy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 26:58 — 18.6MB) | Embed

Episode 8 – The Life of Mystagogy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg Ph.D.

Dr. David Fagerberg and Kris McGregor discuss our baptism and the meaning of “mystagogy.”

Here are some of the topics explored in this episode:

– What is it to live the liturgy?

– What occurs at our baptism?

– What is our role true role in the liturgical celebration?

– What is the nature of “mystagogy?”

From the discussion with Dr. Fagerberg:

Liturgy is doing the world the way it was meant to be done, but I can’t do it the way it was meant to be done unless I know what I am supposed to be doing. And unless I know what God wants me to be doing, and unless I know what God intends for the world. So I have to spend some time with the blueprint drawer, with the architect, with the designer. I don’t know how this family should operate, or this marriage should operate, or this justice in society should operate unless they spend some time with the source of love and the source of justice and the source of life. So we go into the sacred in order to inhale, so that we can conduct our sacramental, ascetical, and mystical life. I live this life seven days in the world before Icome into the sacred on the eighth day, then I take a step up into heaven, so that I can see heaven around me.

For more podcast episodes of this series, visit the Pathways to Sacred Mysteries w/Dr. David Fagerberg page

He also has an avocation in G. K. Chesterton, having published Chesterton is Everywhere (Emmaus Press, 2013) and The Size of Chesterton’s Catholicism (University of Notre Dame, 1998).

Here are a few of Dr. Fagerberg’s books:

PSM9 – The Liturgical Bridge to Mystery – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 27:50 — 19.2MB) | Embed

Episode 9 – The Liturgical Bridge to Mystery – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg Ph.D.

Dr. David Fagerberg and Kris McGregor discuss the “stages” of the spiritual journey and the vices which hinder growth in holiness.

Here are some of the topics explored in this episode:

– Praktike (purgation), Physike (illumination), and Theologia (union with God)

From the discussion with Dr. Fagerberg:

What’s the right relationship between our asceticism and liturgical mysticism?

I thought I would write a book on liturgical acestism and then write a book on liturgical mysticism, so I could find out, but I finished them both, and I’m not sure that I’m done with it yet. I liked the key you gave in our earlier conversation that I don’t need to try to come up with a liturgical bridge to asceticism. And then another liturgical bridge to mysticism, liturgy is the bridge between those two. So if I walk the bridge of liturgy, I’ll find on the east end and the west end, the north end and the south end of this bridge, both of them, I know that mysticism awaits us at the end of asceticism, as I understood it from the tradition. And in that book (On Liturgical Ascetism), I primarily dealt with Eastern and Orthodox material. I understand mysticism to be at the end of it because when it goes through these stages of praktike, physike, and theologia, in order to arrive theologia which union with God. Well, what better definition of mysticism do I need? Um, mysticism must surely have some requirements of us in efforts of us. Well, yeah. Mysticism assumes asceticism, asceticism assumes mysticism, but if the emphasis is on a different syllable, it seems like one of them starts with the efforts required. With askesis, training, discipline effort we arrive at the mystery and the other starts with the mystery, but acknowledges that the purgation and illumination will precede this unification. I think they’re related. And I’ve got a number of metaphors for the relationship, but I don’t think enough of them yet. And they’re not entirely happy.

For more podcast episodes of this series, visit the Pathways to Sacred Mysteries w/Dr. David Fagerberg page

He also has an avocation in G. K. Chesterton, having published Chesterton is Everywhere (Emmaus Press, 2013) and The Size of Chesterton’s Catholicism (University of Notre Dame, 1998).

Here are a few of Dr. Fagerberg’s books:

PSM10 – The Inward then Outward, Upward then Downward Movement of Liturgy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 28:12 — 19.5MB) | Embed

Episode 10 – The Inward then Outward, Upward then Downward Movement of Liturgy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg Ph.D.

Dr. David Fagerberg and Kris McGregor discuss the Anabatic and Katabatic movements of the liturgy.

Here are some of the topics explored in this episode:

From the discussion with Dr. Fagerberg:

This is from my theological diary once more. There are two movements in the liturgy and the Greek language identified them as anabatic and katabatic. Basis means to go. Anabatic is to go up. Katabatic is to go down. The anabatic movement in liturgy is our ascent into the heavenly realms. Lift up your hearts. The katabatic is the spirit’s descent upon the assembly and the sacrifice.

Oh, the dictionary includes a meteorological definition for Anabasis as well. It says pertaining to an uphill wind produced by the effects of local heating. No wait. That’s a Pentecostal definition. The dictionary also gives a spatial metaphor. Anabasis, it says, is a march from the coast to the interior, where in silence one will find the Holy Spirit waiting. While Catabasis is a march from the interior of a country to the coast, where in need one will find the world waiting.

Every liturgy is a two-way march inward then outward, or upward then downward. But here’s the paragraph that made me think of it now and this is just especially for you in your tornado. The prefix acro means aloft. The Holy Spirit restores Adam and Eve’s wings making us liturgical acrobats, acrobasis, tumbling twirling, doing barrel rolls with the angels above the altar. Liturgical aestheticism lightens one’s gravity and increases the measure of our liturgical capacity.

So I’ll open a summer camp for liturgical acrobats and the people who have a thin definition will think that I’m actually doing something like a clown liturgy, but will actually start with prayer fasting and alms giving. Try to overcome the passions, learn how to overcome the passions so that we could become lofty liturgists twirling aloft. Acrobasis. I told you I don’t know other languages. I mean, I’m just bad at it. I passed my language exams, but I do like single words and they just turn like a ruby. They don’t have all those other words cluttering up the sentence, those single words are just gems to me.

For more podcast episodes of this series, visit the Pathways to Sacred Mysteries w/Dr. David Fagerberg page

He also has an avocation in G. K. Chesterton, having published Chesterton is Everywhere (Emmaus Press, 2013) and The Size of Chesterton’s Catholicism (University of Notre Dame, 1998).

Here are a few of Dr. Fagerberg’s books:

PSM11 – Ascetical Struggle and a Mystical Joy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 28:43 — 19.8MB) | Embed

Episode 11 – Ascetical Struggle and a Mystical Joy – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg, Ph.D.

Dr. David Fagerberg and Kris McGregor discuss the chronological and kairos nature of time and its dimensions in the liturgy, particularly on Sunday.

Here are some of the topics explored in this episode:

The definition of liturgy: Liturgy is the perichoresis of the Trinity kenotically extended to invite our synergistic ascent into deification.

From the discussion with Dr. Fagerberg:

This is why it’s important for worshiping on Sunday, the Lord’s Day for the Lord’s people in the Lord’s house at the Lord’s table. Sunday is this eighth day, the day of the resurrection. After six days of creation, got rested on the seventh, and when humanity fell into sin, God had to act again. So Sunday, the day of resurrection, is like one more day in the Book of Genesis being added as an appendix. And Taft says to anyone beginning the study of Sunday, “The initial impression is one of confusion.” Sunday is the first day, the day of creation, the day of light, the day of the new time. I think it’s just named the cosmic dimensions of Sunday, but it’s also the last day, the eighth day, the day beyond the days, the day of Jubilee, the day of the end time.

Now he has named the eschatological dimensions of Sunday. It’s the day of the resurrection, the day of the post-resurrection appearances and meals. Watch for that in the scripture readings eight days later on Sunday. It’s the day of the descent of the Spirit and the day of the ascension. These are the historical Jesus days.

And then, he gives finally the ecclesiological church meanings. The day of the assembly, the day of the Eucharist, the day of baptism, the day of ordinations. Until one asks, “Is there anything Sunday doesn’t mean?” And the answer of course, is no. For the early Church Sunday was indeed everything. The symbolic day, a sign of the time of the church between ascension and parousia, the time in which we are living now, it’s the day symbolic of all days for… And here’s the quote, which I stumbled on in our earlier conversation so I can slip it in here. “It’s a day symbolic of all days for the purpose of all Christian liturgy is to express in a ritual moment that which should be the basic stance of every moment of our lives.”

Once a year you celebrate a birthday in a ritual way, but that doesn’t mean you don’t love your kid for the other 364 days. Once a week, you enter into this Eucharistic uplift and twist with God, but that doesn’t mean you forget about him for the other days of the week. What you do on Sunday morning should be an expression of the basic stance of every day, of every hour, of every moment. Well, that seems to me like an ascetical struggle and a mystical joy.

For more podcast episodes of this series, visit the Pathways to Sacred Mysteries w/Dr. David Fagerberg page

He also has an avocation in G. K. Chesterton, having published Chesterton is Everywhere (Emmaus Press, 2013) and The Size of Chesterton’s Catholicism (University of Notre Dame, 1998).

Here are a few of Dr. Fagerberg’s books:

PSM12 – The Two Liturgies: External and Internal – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 33:21 — 23.0MB) | Embed

Episode 12 – The Two Liturgies: External and Internal – Pathway to Sacred Mysteries with Dr. David Fagerberg, Ph.D.

Dr. David Fagerberg and Kris McGregor discuss “the two liturgies,” the external and internal action of the Eucharist.

Here are some of the topics explored in this episode:

The Noetic faculty in the heart (meaning perception of the heart)
Hesychia – stilleness, rest, quiet, silence

From the discussion with Dr. Fagerberg:

I’m looking for a quote, it’s from a contemporary Orthodox Metropolitan named Hierotheos, and he says, if the noetic faculty in the heart is operating, then we can come in contact with, what he calls, a second liturgy, “something happens that seems strange to most people, but is natural for those who consciously practice hesychia.” This is a silence, contemplative. “Although they are present at the Divine Eucharist and are aware through their senses and their reason of everything going on,” those are the first two faculties that I identified, “they’re listening at the same time to the noetic faculty in the heart where the Holy Spirit praises without ceasing. Lord Jesus Christ’s son of God have mercy on me.”

In other words, there are two liturgies. One is the external liturgy of the Divine Eucharist, where the bread and wine are changed into the body and blood of Christ in the Holy Spirit. The other is the inner liturgy or Eucharist, where they experience uncreated worship and the spiritual priest of divine grace celebrates. There’s no break between the two liturgies. Both are accomplished with full awareness. The Holy Spirit changes the bread and wine into Christ’s body and blood, and the same Holy Spirit activates noetic prayer on the altar of the heart.

Well, by talking about aestheticism and mysticism, my purpose has been to try to make us think about… That sounds like I just denied everything I’ve been saying. I’m trying to make us think about something, make us think about this synergy going on, and I am trying to make us think about it. I’m writing books about Mrs. Murphy. I don’t want her to read them, but I write about Mrs. Murphy for my colleagues. So that my colleagues, I made a sweeping gesture to mean the academic world, so that they don’t look down their noses at Mrs. Murphy. My lesson from Aidan Kavanagh and the thesis is that Mrs. Murphy is a true theologian and I’m making an apologetic for her.

For more podcast episodes of this series, visit the Pathways to Sacred Mysteries w/Dr. David Fagerberg page

He also has an avocation in G. K. Chesterton, having published Chesterton is Everywhere (Emmaus Press, 2013) and The Size of Chesterton’s Catholicism (University of Notre Dame, 1998).

Here are a few of Dr. Fagerberg’s books:

The Poor/Holy Souls and Purgatory – Building a Kingdom of Love w/ Msgr. John Esseff

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 27:53 — 19.3MB) | Embed

Msgr. Esseff reflects on the teaching of the Sacred Scriptures and on how we pray for the Poor Souls in Purgatory:

Reading 1 Wis 3:1-9

The souls of the just are in the hand of God,
and no torment shall touch them.
They seemed, in the view of the foolish, to be dead;
and their passing away was thought an affliction
and their going forth from us, utter destruction.
But they are in peace.
For if before men, indeed, they be punished,
yet is their hope full of immortality;
chastised a little, they shall be greatly blessed,
because God tried them
and found them worthy of himself.
As gold in the furnace, he proved them,
and as sacrificial offerings he took them to himself.
In the time of their visitation they shall shine,
and shall dart about as sparks through stubble;
they shall judge nations and rule over peoples,
and the LORD shall be their King forever.
Those who trust in him shall understand truth,
and the faithful shall abide with him in love:
because grace and mercy are with his holy ones,
and his care is with his elect.

Msgr. John A. Esseff is a Roman Catholic priest in the Diocese of Scranton. Msgr. Esseff served as a retreat director and confessor to St. Teresa of Calcutta. He continues to offer direction and retreats for the sisters of the Missionaries of Charity around the world. Msgr. Esseff encountered St. Padre Pio, who would become a spiritual father to him. He has lived in areas around the world, serving in the Pontifical missions, a Catholic organization established by Pope St. John Paul II to bring the Good News to the world, especially to the poor. Msgr. Esseff assisted the founders of the Institute for Priestly Formation and continues to serve as a spiritual director for the Institute. He continues to serve as a retreat leader and director to bishops, priests and sisters and seminarians, and other religious leaders around the world.

Novena for the Holy Souls in Purgatory Day 9

Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 4:36 — 10.5MB) | Embed

composed by by St. Alphonsus of Liguori

Visit the Discerning Hearts “Holy Souls” page for the complete novena and text of the prayers

My God! How was it possible that I, for so many years, have borne tranquilly the separation from Thee and Thy holy grace! O infinite Goodness, how long-suffering hast Thou shown Thyself to me! Henceforth, I shall love Thee above all things. I am deeply sorry for having offended Thee; I promise rather to die than to again offend Thee. Grant me the grace of holy perseverance, and do not permit that I should ever again fall into sin. Have compassion on the holy souls in Purgatory. I pray Thee, moderate their sufferings; shorten the time of their misery; call them soon unto Thee in heaven, that they may behold Thee face to face, and forever love Thee. Mary, Mother of Mercy, come to their aid with thy powerful intercession, and pray for us also who are still in danger of eternal damnation.

Say the following prayers: 1 Our Father… 1 Hail Mary…

The Prayer to Our Suffering Savior for the Holy Souls in Purgatory

O most sweet Jesus, through the bloody sweat which Thou didst suffer in the Garden of Gethsemane, have mercy on these Blessed Souls. Have mercy on them. R. Have mercy on them, O Lord.

O most sweet Jesus, through the pains which Thou didst suffer during Thy most cruel scourging, have mercy on them. R. Have mercy on them, O Lord.

O most sweet Jesus, through the pains which Thou didst suffer in Thy most painful crowning with thorns, have mercy on them. R. Have mercy on them, O Lord.

O most sweet Jesus, through the pains which Thou didst suffer in carrying Thy cross to Calvary, have mercy on them. R. Have mercy on them, O Lord.

O most sweet Jesus, through the pains which Thou didst suffer during Thy most cruel Crucifixion, have mercy on them. R. Have mercy on them, O Lord.

O most sweet Jesus, through the pains which Thou didst suffer in Thy most bitter agony on the Cross, have mercy on them. R. Have mercy on them, O Lord.

O most sweet Jesus, through the immense pain which Thou didst suffer in breathing forth Thy Blessed Soul, have mercy on them. R. Have mercy on them, O Lord.

(State your intention(s) here while recommending yourself to the souls in Purgatory.)

Blessed Souls, I have prayed for thee; I entreat thee, who are so dear to God, and who are secure of never losing Him, to pray for me a miserable sinner, who is in danger of being damned, and of losing God forever. Amen.