St. Gregory of Narek – The Doctors of the Church: The Charism of Wisdom with Dr. Matthew Bunson – Discerning Hearts Podcast

St. Gregory of Narek – The Doctors of the Church: The Charism of Wisdom with Dr. Matthew Bunson

  • Born: 951 Rshtunik, Vaspurakan, Bagratid Armenia
  • Died: 1003 Narekavank, Vaspurakan, Armenia
  • Feast Day: 13 October (Holy Translators day); 27 February (Roman Catholic Church)

Dr. Matthew Bunson and Kris McGregor discuss the significance of St. Gregory of Narek being declared the 36th Doctor of the Church by Pope Francis in 2015. St. Gregory’s profound contributions to Christian spirituality, particularly his “Book of Lamentations,” is a collection of 95 poetic prayers that deeply resonate with themes of humility, suffering, and the longing for union with God. A mystic, theologian, and poet of the Armenian Church, is recognized for his ability to express the depths of human brokenness and the hope found in divine mercy. His writings are compared to those of St. Augustine and St. John of the Cross, emphasizing their ability to guide the faithful toward a personal encounter with God through lament and prayer.

St. Gregory’s life, shaped by early suffering and monastic formation, deeply influenced his spiritual insight. His work remains central to Armenian Christianity, with prayers from the “Book of Lamentations” integrated into the Armenian liturgy. The podcast considers how Gregory’s appointment as a Doctor of the Church invites the broader Catholic Church to engage more deeply with Eastern Christian traditions and spirituality.


Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. How does the Church’s recognition of St. Gregory of Narek as a Doctor deepen our understanding of the spiritual treasures within Eastern Christianity?
  2. In what ways can Gregory’s “Book of Lamentations” teach us to transform our suffering into a path toward deeper union with God?
  3. How does Gregory’s emphasis on humility challenge our approach to prayer and our relationship with God?
  4. What does Gregory’s mystical theology reveal about the call to holiness and the pursuit of intimate communion with God for all believers?
  5. How can the integration of Gregory’s prayers into the Armenian liturgy inspire a deeper appreciation for the role of sacred tradition in personal prayer?
  6. How does Gregory’s work invite Latin Rite Catholics to explore the richness of Eastern Christian theology and worship?
  7. What can the faithfulness of the Armenian Church, especially through suffering, teach us about perseverance in our own spiritual journey?
  8. How can engaging with the writings of lesser-known Doctors, like Gregory, expand our understanding of Catholic spirituality and deepen our faith?

From the Vatican Insider:

Pope Francis has approved the decision of the Congregation for Saints. The Armenian saint was born in 950 AD in present-day Turkey

ANDREA TORNIELLI: VATICAN CITY

”An Armenian saint has been declared a Doctor of the Church. In last Saturday’s audience with the cardinal Prefect of the Congregation for the Causes of Saints, Pope Francis approved the proposal put forward by the Plenary Session of the Congregation, agreeing for the title of Doctor of the Universal Church to be conferred upon Gregory of Narek.

St. Gregory, a priest and monk, was born circa 950 AD in Andzevatsik (formerly Armenia, present-day Turkey) to a family of writers. He died circa 1005 in Narek (formerly Armenia, present-day Turkey). His father, Khosrov, was an archbishop. Having lost his mother at a young age, Gregory was brought up by his cousin, Anania of Narek, founder of the local school and village. The saint lived most of his life in the monasteries of Narek (in what was once called Great Armenia), where he taught at the monastic school. He is considered one of Armenian literature’s greatest poets.

The cult of St. Gregory of Narek will be marked on 27 February in the Roman Martyrology. He will be defined as “monk, doctor of the Armenians, distinguished for his writings and mystic science”.

The papal decision comes just weeks before Francis is due to commemorate the centenary of the Armenian massacre on 12 April in St. Peter’s Basilica. The Medz Yeghern as the Armenian massacre is called, took place in 1915.”

For more from Dr. Matthew Bunson check out his Discerning Hearts page

Dr. Matthew E. Bunson is a Register senior editor and a senior contributor to EWTN News. For the past 20 years, he has been active in the area of Catholic social communications and education, including writing, editing, and teaching on a variety of topics related to Church history, the papacy, the saints, and Catholic culture. He is faculty chair at Catholic Distance University, a senior fellow of the St. Paul Center for Biblical Theology, and the author or co-author of over 50 books including The Encyclopedia of Catholic History, The Pope Encyclopedia, We Have a Pope! Benedict XVI, The Saints Encyclopedia and best-selling biographies of St. Damien of Molokai and St. Kateri Tekakwitha.

TM12 – The Death of St. Thérèse – St. Therese and Marie: The Story of Two Cousins with Fr. Timothy Gallagher – Discerning Hearts Podcast

The Death of St. Thérèse – St. Thérèse and Marie: The Story of Two Cousins with Fr. Timothy Gallagher

St. Thérèse of Lisieux

Fr. Timothy Gallagher and Kris McGregor discuss the final moments of St. Thérèse of Lisieux, drawing from the detailed account written by her sister Pauline, also known as Mother Agnes of Jesus. As Thérèse approached death at the age of 24, she endured immense physical suffering from tuberculosis, compounded by deep spiritual desolation. Despite this, she remained centered on love and trust in God, uttering her final words, “My God, I love you,” while gazing at her crucifix. Her last moments were marked by a profound surrender to God’s will, even in the face of excruciating pain. The sisters in her Carmelite community observed a radiant transformation in her countenance after death, interpreting it as a sign of her immediate entry into eternal joy.

Fr. Gallagher also touches on the impact of Thérèse’s passing on her cousin Marie and other family members. Marie, who struggled with scrupulosity, experienced a deepening of her spiritual life, reflecting the grace Thérèse had promised to shower upon souls from heaven. Shortly after, Marie’s mother, Céline, also passed away, reinforcing the family’s growing sense of heavenly intercession. Their letters reveal a profound love for family, which did not diminish in the cloister but grew stronger through their sanctity.


Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. St. Thérèse’s final words reflect complete trust in God—how do I respond when faced with suffering and uncertainty?
  2. Despite immense physical and spiritual agony, Thérèse continued to express love—how can I cultivate love even in my own trials?
  3. Thérèse and her family remained deeply united in faith—how does my love for my family reflect my journey toward holiness?
  4. Thérèse saw her suffering as a way to bring souls to God—how can I intentionally offer my struggles for the salvation of others?
  5. Her family found comfort knowing their loved ones were interceding from heaven—how often do I turn to the saints for help and guidance?
  6. Thérèse’s love for her family grew through her union with Christ—how does my relationship with God shape the way I love others?
  7. Thérèse embraced death as a gateway to heaven—how am I preparing my heart each day for the moment I will meet God?

About this Series

Fr. Timothy Gallagher reflects upon the enduring legacy of St. Thérèse of Lisieux, exploring how her life and spirituality were deeply influenced by her family and how it offers profound insights into everyday holiness. He examines the role of family and spiritual friendships in nurturing faith, the importance of compassionate care for others, and how Thérèse’s example can inspire listeners to seek sanctity in their daily lives. He also brings forth more details of the spiritual bond between the Martin and Guérin families, offering a model for fostering deeper connections within one’s own family and community.


Father Timothy M. Gallagher, O.M.V., was ordained in 1979 as a member of the Oblates of the Virgin Mary, a religious community dedicated to retreats and spiritual formation according to the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius.  Fr. Gallagher is featured on the EWTN series “Living the Discerning Life:  The Spiritual Teachings of St. Ignatius of Loyola.” For more information on how to obtain copies of Fr. Gallaghers’s various books and audio, which are available for purchase, please visit  his  website:   frtimothygallagher.org

Did you know that Fr. Timothy Gallagher has 14 different podcast series on Discerning Hearts Catholic Podcasts?
Visit here to discover more!

BTP-LR4 – Day 4 – The Last Retreat by St. Elizabeth of the Trinity – Beginning to Pray with Dr. Anthony Lilles – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Day 4 – The Last Retreat by St. Elizabeth of the Trinity- Beginning to Pray with Dr. Anthony Lilles

Dr. Anthony Lilles and Kris McGregor discuss the fourth day of St. Elizabeth of the Trinity’s 16‑day retreat. They reflect on how contemplative prayer is not about performing spiritual exercises to achieve a measurable outcome but about surrendering one’s own control and expectations to welcome God’s transformative love.

Weaving together insights from scripture and Carmelite spirituality, particularly the teachings of St. John of the Cross, illustrates that moments of doubt or even the dark night of faith are not failures but essential passages toward a profound, unshakeable trust in God.


Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. How can I release my need to control my prayer experience and open my heart to God’s transformative love instead?
  2.  In what ways can I view moments of spiritual darkness as opportunities for growth and deeper faith?
  3. How does my current practice of prayer serve as a foretaste of the eternal peace promised in the beatific vision?
  4. How can I deepen my understanding of heaven beyond cultural clichés to experience a profound relationship with God?
  5. What steps can I take to strengthen my trust in God’s plan even when I face uncertainty or doubt?
  6. How can I extend compassionate support to those enduring spiritual trials, mirroring Christ’s presence in their lives?

Saint Elizabeth of the Trinity
St. Elizabeth of the Trinity

From “Last Retreat Day 3” found in The Complete Works vol 1:

“10. Here faith, the beautiful light of faith appears. It alone should light my way as I go to meet the Bridegroom. The psalmist sings that He “hides Himself in darkness,” 59 then in another place he seems to contradict himself by saying that “light surrounds Him like a cloak.” 60 What stands out for me in this apparent contradiction is that I must immerse myself in “the sacred darkness” 61 by putting all my powers in darkness and emptiness ; then I will meet my Master, and “the light that surrounds Him like a cloak ” will envelop me also, for He wants His bride to be luminous with His light, His light alone, “which is the glory of God.”

This the text we are using to discuss “Heaven in Faith” you can find it here and order from the Carmelite Sisters


We would like to thank Miriam Gutierrez for providing “the voice” of St. Elizabeth for this series

For other episodes in the series visit the Discerning Hearts page for Dr. Anthony Lilles


Anthony Lilles, S.T.D., has served the Church and assisted in the formation of clergy and seminarians since 1994. Before coming to St. Patrick’s, he served at seminaries and houses of formation in the Archdiocese of Denver and the Archdiocese of Los Angeles. The son of a California farmer, married with young adult children, holds a B.A. in theology from the Franciscan University of Steubenville with both the ecclesiastical licentiate and doctorate in spiritual theology from the Pontifical University of Saint Thomas Aquinas in Rome (the Angelicum). An expert in the writings of St. Elizabeth of the Trinity and the Carmelite Doctors of the Church, he co-founded the Avila Institute for Spiritual Formation and the High Calling Program for priestly vocations. He also founded the John Paul II Center for Contemplative Culture, which hosts symposiums, retreats, and conferences. In addition to his publications, he blogs at www.beginningtopray.com .

BTP-LR3 – Day 3 – The Last Retreat by St. Elizabeth of the Trinity- Beginning to Pray with Dr. Anthony Lilles – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Day 3 – The Last Retreat by St. Elizabeth of the Trinity- Beginning to Pray with Dr. Anthony Lilles

Dr. Anthony Lilles and Kris McGregor explore St. Elizabeth of the Trinity’s retreat, The Last Retreat, focusing on the transformative power of prayer. Elizabeth’s mission is to guide souls into mystical contemplation, where deep prayer fosters holiness through constant awareness of God’s presence. Drawing from St. Paul’s teachings on predestination, God’s eternal plan is for all to share in His glory through Christ. Prayer is not passive but an active engagement with God’s love, which purifies and elevates the soul, making it a vessel of divine grace.

The virtue of simplicity in prayer likens it to the contemplative vision of the blessed in heaven. Prayer simplifies the soul, allowing God’s attributes to shine through and transforming daily life into an expression of divine love. We must embrace silent, contemplative prayer, even when it feels unproductive, as it deepens the soul’s union with God.


Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. God’s Eternal Plan for Us: Reflect on how God’s predestination calls you to live as the praise of His glory through daily prayer and trust in His divine will.
  2. Transformative Power of Prayer: Consider how silent, contemplative prayer can transform your soul, making you more open to God’s love and grace in everyday life.
  3. Simplicity in the Spiritual Life: Examine areas in your life where simplicity and stillness can help you rest in God’s presence and deepen your relationship with Him.
  4. Union with God through Suffering: Ponder how trials and suffering, when surrendered to God, can be a means for spiritual growth and deeper union with His heart.
  5. Your Call to Reflect God’s Love: Ask yourself how your prayer life enables you to radiate God’s love to others and contribute to healing and peace in the world.

Blessed Elizabeth of the Trinity
Blessed Elizabeth of the Trinity

From “Last Retreat Day 3” found in The Complete Works vol 1:

“The soul, by the simplicity of the gaze which it fixes on its divine object, finds itself set apart  from all that surrounds it, set apart also and above all from itself. Then it is resplendent with this “knowledge of the glory of God,”  of which the Apostle speaks, because it permits the divine Being to be reflected in it, “and all His attributes are communicated to it.”  Truly this soul is the praise of glory of all His gifts; through everything, even the most commonplace acts, it sings the canticum magnum, the canticum novum . . . ,  and this canticle thrills God to His very depths.”

This the text we are using to discuss “Heaven in Faith” you can find it here and order from the Carmelite Sisters


We would like to thank Miriam Gutierrez for providing “the voice” of St. Elizabeth for this series

For other episodes in the series visit the Discerning Hearts page for Dr. Anthony Lilles


Anthony Lilles, S.T.D., has served the Church and assisted in the formation of clergy and seminarians since 1994. Before coming to St. Patrick’s, he served at seminaries and houses of formation in the Archdiocese of Denver and the Archdiocese of Los Angeles. The son of a California farmer, married with young adult children, holds a B.A. in theology from the Franciscan University of Steubenville with both the ecclesiastical licentiate and doctorate in spiritual theology from the Pontifical University of Saint Thomas Aquinas in Rome (the Angelicum). An expert in the writings of St. Elizabeth of the Trinity and the Carmelite Doctors of the Church, he co-founded the Avila Institute for Spiritual Formation and the High Calling Program for priestly vocations. He also founded the John Paul II Center for Contemplative Culture, which hosts symposiums, retreats, and conferences. In addition to his publications, he blogs at www.beginningtopray.com .

MC7 – Practical Steps for Prayer – Meditation and Contemplation with Fr. Timothy Gallagher – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Practical Steps for Prayer – Meditation and Contemplation with Fr. Timothy Gallagher

Fr. Timothy Gallagher explores how to integrate Ignatian meditation and contemplation into daily life by offering practical methods for selecting scripture passages. He highlights two primary approaches: using the daily Mass readings for a structured connection to the liturgical year or systematically working through a Gospel with flexibility to revisit passages that resonate deeply. Using simple spiritual commentaries to enrich understanding, he suggests finding a balance between structure and adaptability to sustain daily prayer.

Perseverance is crucial through spiritual ups and downs. Drawing from saints like St. Catherine of Siena and St. John Paul II, who advocate for prayer as the foundation of spiritual growth, Fr. Gallagher shares a practical spiritual program from Venerable Bruno Lanteri, encouraging daily meditation, spiritual reading, and an examen. He concludes with an encouraging reminder from Romans 8:26 that the Holy Spirit aids our weakness in prayer, offering hope and strength for a faithful prayer life.


St.-Ignatius-5

Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. Incorporating Scripture into Daily Prayer: How can I structure my daily prayer using either the daily Mass readings or a systematic reading of a Gospel while remaining flexible to the Spirit’s promptings?
  2. Utilizing Spiritual Commentaries: What role can a simple spiritual commentary play in deepening my understanding of Scripture during prayer?
  3. Persevering Through Spiritual Highs and Lows: How can I remain faithful to daily prayer amidst both spiritual consolation and desolation?
  4. Following Practical Spiritual Practices: How can I incorporate daily meditation, spiritual reading, and an examen into my life as recommended by Venerable Bruno Lanteri?
  5. Relying on the Holy Spirit in Prayer: How can I trust in the Holy Spirit’s assistance when I feel weak or unsure in my prayer life?

Father Timothy M. Gallagher, O.M.V., was ordained in 1979 as a member of the Oblates of the Virgin Mary, a religious community dedicated to retreats and spiritual formation according to the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius.  Fr. Gallagher is featured on the EWTN series “Living the Discerning Life:  The Spiritual Teachings of St. Ignatius of Loyola.” For more information on how to obtain copies of Fr. Gallaghers’s various books and audio, which are available for purchase, please visit  his  website:   frtimothygallagher.org

Did you know that Fr. Timothy Gallagher has 15 different podcast series on Discerning Hearts Catholic Podcasts?
Visit here to discover more!

The Beatitudes – Building a Kingdom Love with Msgr. John Esseff – Discerning Hearts Podcast

The Beatitudes – Building a Kingdom Love with Msgr. John Esseff

Msgr. John Esseff explores the distinction between joy and happiness, highlighting that true joy is a fruit of the Holy Spirit and is deeply rooted in fulfilling God’s will. Reflecting on the Beatitudes and the example of St. Francis of Assisi, he illustrates how authentic joy is often found in humility, suffering, and selflessness rather than worldly success. Joy comes from an interior life aligned with Christ, who lives within the baptized, enabling believers to find peace even amidst trials and rejection.

Unforgiveness breeds anger and unhappiness, often becoming an identity trap and requiring the need for self-forgiveness, recounting poignant stories of individuals burdened by past sins, and emphasizes that God’s infinite mercy can heal even the deepest wounds. True humility and joy arise from recognizing one’s unique identity in God’s creation, embracing one’s true self, and allowing Christ’s resurrection to transform personal wounds into sources of grace and radiance for the world.


Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. The Source of True Joy: Reflect on how living according to God’s will and embracing humility, as exemplified by the Beatitudes, brings authentic joy beyond worldly measures.
  2. Embracing Forgiveness: Consider how holding onto unforgiveness toward others, oneself, or past wounds can hinder spiritual joy and how Christ’s mercy invites healing.
  3. Christ Within Us: Ponder the reality of Christ living within the baptized and how daily union with Him shapes attitudes, choices, and inner peace.
  4. Unique Identity in God: Meditate on the uniqueness of your creation by God, recognizing that your true self is a gift to the world and a source of joy when fully embraced.
  5. Transforming Wounds into Grace: Reflect on how personal wounds, like those of the risen Christ, can become glorious through His healing, offering hope and witness to others.

Gospel: Luke 6:17, 20-26

Jesus came down with the Twelve
and stood on a stretch of level ground
with a great crowd of his disciples
and a large number of the people
from all Judea and Jerusalem
and the coastal region of Tyre and Sidon.
And raising his eyes toward his disciples he said:
“Blessed are you who are poor,
for the kingdom of God is yours.
Blessed are you who are now hungry,
for you will be satisfied.
Blessed are you who are now weeping,
for you will laugh.
Blessed are you when people hate you,
and when they exclude and insult you,
and denounce your name as evil
on account of the Son of Man.
Rejoice and leap for joy on that day!
Behold, your reward will be great in heaven.
For their ancestors treated the prophets in the same way.
But woe to you who are rich,
for you have received your consolation.
Woe to you who are filled now,
for you will be hungry.
Woe to you who laugh now,
for you will grieve and weep.
Woe to you when all speak well of you,
for their ancestors treated the false prophets in this way.”


Msgr. John A. Esseff is a Roman Catholic priest in the Diocese of Scranton.  He was ordained on May 30, 1953, by the late Bishop William J. Hafey, D.D. at St. Peter’s Cathedral in Scranton, PA.  Msgr. Esseff served a retreat director and confessor to St.  Teresa of Calcutta.    He continues to offer direction and retreats for the sisters of the Missionaries of Charity around the world.  Msgr. Esseff encountered St.  Padre Pio,  who would become a spiritual father to him.  He has lived in areas around the world,  serving in the Pontifical Missions, a Catholic organization established by St. Pope John Paul II to bring the Good News to the world especially to the poor.  Msgr. Esseff assisted the founders of the Institute for Priestly Formation and continues to serve as a spiritual director for the Institute.  He continues to serve as a retreat leader and director to bishops, priests and sisters and seminarians and other religious leaders around the world.  

SJC12 – Dawning Light of the Gift of Contemplation – St. John of the Cross with Fr. Donald Haggerty – Discerning Hearts Podcast


Dawning Light of the Gift of Contemplation – St. John of the Cross: Master of Contemplation with Fr. Donald Haggerty

Fr. Donald Haggerty discusses St. John of the Cross’s teachings on the early stages of contemplative prayer, focusing on the transition from meditative prayer to the reception of contemplative graces. Many souls struggle during this period, feeling frustration and dryness when their usual methods of prayer no longer yield the same consolation. This period, described in St. John’s writings, can become a spiritual crossroads where misunderstanding can hinder growth, potentially leading to stagnation. It’s necessary to have proper guidance to help souls recognize and cooperate with God’s deeper work, even in the absence of consolations.

He also contrasts this experience with St. Ignatius of Loyola’s teaching on desolation, noting that St. John of the Cross is addressing a different kind of interior struggle—one not marked by a loss of faith or desire for God, but rather a shift in how grace operates in the soul. Many well-intentioned individuals, including religious and laypeople, mistakenly try to force previous methods of prayer, not realizing that God is calling them to a new way of relating to Him.


Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. The Transition from Meditative to Contemplative Prayer: How have you experienced moments in prayer where familiar methods no longer bring the same sense of connection or consolation, and how did you respond?
  2. Spiritual Crossroads and Interior Growth: When faced with dryness or difficulty in prayer, do you persist in previous methods, or do you seek to understand how God may be inviting you to deeper trust?
  3. The Role of Spiritual Direction: If access to a trained spiritual director is limited, how can you seek guidance through the wisdom of the saints, particularly St. John of the Cross, in navigating deeper prayer?
  4. Discerning Desolation and Contemplative Grace: In times of spiritual dryness, how do you distinguish between the desolation that calls for perseverance and the invitation to surrender to a new mode of prayer?
  5. Trusting God’s Hidden Work in the Soul: How can you cultivate a greater trust in God’s work in your prayer life, even when it feels unclear or different from past experiences?

An excerpt from St. John of the Cross: Master of Contemplation

“We are ready now to take up the teaching of Saint John of the Cross on contemplation. However, it can be beneficial to ease a bit into the subject, which is what Saint John of the Cross does in his writings. On a few occasions, for instance, he mentions a primary motive for him in taking up his pen. A matter of critical importance for him—“extremely necessary to so many souls” (AMC Prologue 3)—is the harm done to souls who do not recognize the initial symptoms of contemplative graces and do not adjust their approach to prayer accordingly. The failure to advance into contemplation when the grace is being offered is, for him, a great misfortune. A lack of understanding is the obvious reason and an excuse of sorts; nonetheless, this ignorance is consequential and requires remedy.

The loss is inestimable, not just to particular souls, but to the vast fruitfulness that a contemplative soul can bear for the sake of others. Saint John of the Cross wastes no time in bringing up the issue. The first pages of the Prologue to The Ascent of Mount Carmel express his lament. When he refers to the “dark night” in the following passage, he is referring to the initial experience of purification that occurs as the grace of contemplation commences. What should not be missed in this passage is also the opening phrase. The initial graces of contemplative prayer do not presume the rarity of a saintly life, but a life sincerely engaged in a wholehearted pursuit of virtue.”

Haggerty, Donald. Saint John of the Cross: Master of Contemplation (p. 158). Ignatius Press. Kindle Edition.


For more episodes in this series visit Fr. Haggerty’s Discerning Hearts page here


You find the book on which this series is based here.

BTP-LR2 – Day 2 – The Last Retreat by St. Elizabeth of the Trinity- Beginning to Pray with Dr. Anthony Lilles – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Day 2 – The Last Retreat by St. Elizabeth of the Trinity- Beginning to Pray with Dr. Anthony Lilles

Dr. Anthony Lilles and Kris McGregor explore St. Elizabeth of the Trinity’s retreat writings, particularly her reflections on interior silence and self-possession in Christ. St. Elizabeth describes how true peace comes from gathering one’s interior faculties through silence and surrendering them to God. She highlights the significance of the phrase Nescivi, meaning “I no longer know anything but Him,” illustrating the soul’s complete focus on God despite external turmoil or inner struggles. Drawing from Carmelite spirituality, holy recollection fosters this unity with God, allowing the soul to become a vessel for divine grace and harmony.

The transformative power of suffering and trials gives us a chance to use them as opportunities for deeper union with God rather than obstacles to peace. Dr. Lilles connects Elizabeth’s teachings to the experiences of Mary Magdalene and the contemplative example of Mary of Bethany, emphasizing the need to choose “the one thing necessary”—a heart undistracted by worldly concerns. He also recounts Elizabeth’s personal battle with suffering in her final days, showing how her unwavering focus on Christ enabled her to endure spiritual and physical affliction with profound trust. This episode offers a compelling call to embrace silence, recollection, and surrender as pathways to deeper intimacy with God.


Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. The Call to Interior Silence: How can you cultivate a habit of holy recollection in your daily life to remain more present to God?
  2. Self-Possession in Christ: In what ways do distractions, emotions, or external pressures pull you away from maintaining a prayerful awareness of Christ?
  3. The Meaning of Nescivi: What does it mean for you personally to surrender everything to God and say, “I no longer know anything but Him”?
  4. Suffering as an Opportunity for Grace: How can trials and hardships in your life be seen as invitations to deeper union with Christ rather than obstacles to peace?
  5. Learning from Mary Magdalene: What aspects of Mary Magdalene’s transformation and devotion inspire you to grow in your own relationship with Christ?
  6. The Role of Holy Recollection in Spiritual Growth: How can you incorporate moments of silent prayer and reflection into your daily routine to foster greater intimacy with God?
  7. Trusting in God’s Hidden Presence: When God feels distant or silent, how can you strengthen your faith and remain steadfast in trust?
  8. The Soul as a Throne of the Holy Trinity: What steps can you take to align your thoughts, emotions, and desires more fully with God’s will so that your soul becomes a dwelling place for His presence?

Blessed Elizabeth of the Trinity
Blessed Elizabeth of the Trinity

From “Last Retreat Day 2” found in The Complete Works vol 1:

5. It is the same for the soul that has entered into the “fortress of holy recollection”:  the eye of its soul, opened in the light of faith, discovers its God present, living within it; in turn it remains so present to Him, in beautiful simplicity,  that He guards it with a jealous care. Then disturbances from without and tempests from within may arise; its self-esteem may be wounded: “Nescivi”! God may hide Himself, withdraw His sensible grace: “Nescivi .” Or, as St. Paul writes: “For love of Him I have forfeited everything.”  Then the Master is free, free to flow into the soul, to give Himself “according to His measure.”  Blessed-Elizabeth-of-the-TrAnd the soul thus simplified, unified, becomes the throne of the Unchanging One, since “unity is the throne of the Holy Trinity.”

This the text we are using to discuss “Heaven in Faith” you can find it here and order from the Carmelite Sisters


We would like to thank Miriam Gutierrez for providing “the voice” of St. Elizabeth for this series

For other episodes in the series visit the Discerning Hearts page for Dr. Anthony Lilles


Anthony Lilles, S.T.D., has served the Church and assisted in the formation of clergy and seminarians since 1994. Before coming to St. Patrick’s, he served at seminaries and houses of formation in the Archdiocese of Denver and the Archdiocese of Los Angeles. The son of a California farmer, married with young adult children, holds a B.A. in theology from the Franciscan University of Steubenville with both the ecclesiastical licentiate and doctorate in spiritual theology from the Pontifical University of Saint Thomas Aquinas in Rome (the Angelicum). An expert in the writings of St. Elizabeth of the Trinity and the Carmelite Doctors of the Church, he co-founded the Avila Institute for Spiritual Formation and the High Calling Program for priestly vocations. He also founded the John Paul II Center for Contemplative Culture, which hosts symposiums, retreats, and conferences. In addition to his publications, he blogs at www.beginningtopray.com .

MC6 – Using Colloquy in Prayer – Meditation and Contemplation with Fr. Timothy Gallagher – Discerning Hearts Podcast

Using Colloquy in Prayer – Meditation and Contemplation with Fr. Timothy Gallagher

Fr. Timothy Gallagher discusses the significance of the colloquy in Ignatian prayer, describing it as the culminating moment when meditation or contemplation transitions into direct, heartfelt conversation with God. Using examples such as the Beatitudes and the storm at sea, he illustrates how scripture reflection leads naturally into personal dialogue with the Lord. This moment of prayer arises spontaneously when the heart, filled with the Word, begins to speak back to God in trust and petition. St. Ignatius encourages resting in this heart-to-heart communication for as long as the soul desires, making it the deepest part of the prayer experience.

Fr. Gallagher also offers a structured example of praying with scripture through the passage of Bartimaeus in Mark 10. He outlines how one might enter into the scene, imagine the setting, and allow the words and actions of Jesus to stir personal prayer. The process includes reading the passage, asking for a specific grace, and then moving into contemplation, where the heart responds to God’s presence.


St.-Ignatius-5

Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. Recognizing God’s Plan: Reflect on how God’s unique design for your life shapes your purpose and daily decisions.
  2. Overcoming Feelings of Unworthiness: Consider how Peter and Isaiah’s encounters with God challenge you to trust in His call despite your weaknesses.
  3. Living Marriage as a Vocation: Examine how your marriage or relationships reflect the self-giving love and commitment God calls you to.
  4. Finding Holiness in Suffering: Contemplate how trials in your life can become a path to greater faith and deeper union with Christ.
  5. Understanding the Depth of Vows: Reflect on the lifelong commitment of marriage or religious vows and how they shape your journey to holiness.
  6. Trusting in God’s Timing: Consider how surrendering control to God’s plan can bring peace and clarity in uncertain situations.
  7. Embracing Self-Sacrificial Love: Meditate on how you are called to give of yourself more fully in your relationships and daily life.
  8. Seeing Christ in Family Life: Ponder how Christ is present in your family’s struggles and joys, guiding you toward holiness.
  9. Responding to God’s Invitation: Examine how you can take concrete steps to follow God’s call more faithfully in your current state of life.
  10. Becoming a Witness of Faith: Consider how your actions and choices reflect Christ’s love and serve as a testimony to others.

Father Timothy M. Gallagher, O.M.V., was ordained in 1979 as a member of the Oblates of the Virgin Mary, a religious community dedicated to retreats and spiritual formation according to the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius.  Fr. Gallagher is featured on the EWTN series “Living the Discerning Life:  The Spiritual Teachings of St. Ignatius of Loyola.” For more information on how to obtain copies of Fr. Gallaghers’s various books and audio, which are available for purchase, please visit  his  website:   frtimothygallagher.org

Did you know that Fr. Timothy Gallagher has 15 different podcast series on Discerning Hearts Catholic Podcasts?
Visit here to discover more!

How Do You Respond to the Father? – Building a Kingdom Love with Msgr. John Esseff – Discerning Hearts Podcast

How Do You Respond to the Father? – Building a Kingdom Love with Msgr. John Esseff

Msgr. John Esseff discusses God’s personal call for each individual and how every person is created with a divine purpose. He reflects on biblical examples, such as Isaiah and Peter, to illustrate how encountering God leads to transformation and mission. A vocation is not limited to religious life but is ultimately a call to holiness, whether in marriage, priesthood, or other states of life.

Using a personal testimony from host Kris McGregor, he explores the challenges and graces of marriage, describing it as a sacramental path to holiness that involves suffering, self-gift, and deep trust in God’s providence. McGregor shares her journey of marriage, parenting, and faith; showing us how God works through difficulties to sanctify spouses, forming them in selfless love. Msgr. Esseff encourages those of us struggling in marriage or discerning their vocation to surrender fully to God’s plan, trusting that even in hardship, He brings resurrection and renewal.


Discerning Hearts Reflection Questions

  1. God’s Unique Plan for You: Reflect on how God has designed you with a specific purpose and how you can be more attentive to His calling in your daily life.
  2. Responding to God’s Call: Consider how Peter and Isaiah reacted to God’s presence and how their examples challenge you to trust and follow God despite personal unworthiness.
  3. Marriage as a Path to Holiness: Think about how marriage, as a vocation, calls spouses to self-giving love and how your own relationships reflect the sacrificial nature of Christ’s love.
  4. Embracing Suffering in Faith: Meditate on how trials and suffering, like those shared in Kris McGregor’s testimony, can be transformative opportunities for spiritual growth and deeper trust in God.
  5. The Power of a Sacramental Vow: Examine the meaning of the vows in marriage or religious life and how you can live them with greater fidelity, recognizing them as a lifelong commitment before God.
  6. Trusting in God’s Providence: Reflect on moments in your life where plans have fallen apart and how you have either resisted or embraced God’s greater design through faith and surrender.
  7. The Call to Self-Giving Love: Consider how Christ’s love is made manifest in your life and whether you are truly giving of yourself in the way God calls you to love others.
  8. Resurrection Through Suffering: Ponder how moments of suffering and loss have led to unexpected blessings or deeper faith, revealing God’s presence even in hardship.
  9. Discerning Your Next Step: Ask yourself what God is calling you to at this moment and how you can respond with greater courage, generosity, and openness to His will.
  10. Witnessing to Christ in Daily Life: Think about how your life—whether in marriage, singlehood, or religious vocation—can serve as a testimony to the love, suffering, and resurrection of Christ.

Reading 2 Col 3:12-21

Brothers and sisters:
Put on, as God’s chosen ones, holy and beloved,
heartfelt compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness, and patience,
bearing with one another and forgiving one another,
if one has a grievance against another;
as the Lord has forgiven you, so must you also do.
And over all these put on love,
that is, the bond of perfection.
And let the peace of Christ control your hearts,
the peace into which you were also called in one body.
And be thankful.
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly,
as in all wisdom you teach and admonish one another,
singing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs
with gratitude in your hearts to God.
And whatever you do, in word or in deed,
do everything in the name of the Lord Jesus,
giving thanks to God the Father through him.Wives, be subordinate to your husbands,
as is proper in the Lord.
Husbands, love your wives,
and avoid any bitterness toward them.
Children, obey your parents in everything,
for this is pleasing to the Lord.
Fathers, do not provoke your children,
so they may not become discouraged.


Msgr. John A. Esseff is a Roman Catholic priest in the Diocese of Scranton.  He was ordained on May 30, 1953, by the late Bishop William J. Hafey, D.D. at St. Peter’s Cathedral in Scranton, PA.  Msgr. Esseff served a retreat director and confessor to St.  Teresa of Calcutta.    He continues to offer direction and retreats for the sisters of the Missionaries of Charity around the world.  Msgr. Esseff encountered St.  Padre Pio,  who would become a spiritual father to him.  He has lived in areas around the world,  serving in the Pontifical Missions, a Catholic organization established by St. Pope John Paul II to bring the Good News to the world especially to the poor.  Msgr. Esseff assisted the founders of the Institute for Priestly Formation and continues to serve as a spiritual director for the Institute.  He continues to serve as a retreat leader and director to bishops, priests and sisters and seminarians and other religious leaders around the world.